1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:04,500 2 00:00:04,500 --> 00:00:10,171 3 00:00:10,171 --> 00:00:13,189 (Questioner) Hi, Sunim, Hi, everyone. 4 00:00:13,189 --> 00:00:17,369 Raising a question in such a large group makes me a little nervous. 5 00:00:17,369 --> 00:00:20,326 So, please bear with me. 6 00:00:20,326 --> 00:00:24,839 The question that I have relates to the concept of emptiness. 7 00:00:24,839 --> 00:00:27,329 Emptiness has come up in a few of your Dharma talks, 8 00:00:27,329 --> 00:00:30,217 your videos, and textbooks a few times. 9 00:00:30,217 --> 00:00:33,969 It also comes up in many of the traditional texts and sutras 10 00:00:33,969 --> 00:00:36,829 like Diamond Sutra and Heart Sutra. 11 00:00:36,829 --> 00:00:40,707 Whenever I read through what emptiness means in the Buddhist concept, 12 00:00:40,707 --> 00:00:44,707 it leaves me a bit more confused 13 00:00:44,707 --> 00:00:49,572 and sometimes a little bit dampened and slightly demotivated. 14 00:00:49,572 --> 00:00:55,652 The reason is because the way I understand it is very shallow. 15 00:00:55,652 --> 00:01:01,782 The way I understand it is that because of the impermanence and the causality 16 00:01:01,782 --> 00:01:07,229 being dependent on each other, things become empty, or things are empty. 17 00:01:07,229 --> 00:01:12,178 But my challenge and difficulty with understanding the concept is 18 00:01:12,178 --> 00:01:17,592 how do I approach it so that I'm not undermining what is important in life, 19 00:01:17,592 --> 00:01:29,806 for instance, family relationships that matter, or ambitions that matter. 20 00:01:29,806 --> 00:01:37,465 That's my question. 21 00:01:37,465 --> 00:01:55,065 (Sunim) We usually express emptiness using the Chinese character 22 00:01:55,065 --> 00:02:00,128 meaning not filled, empty. 23 00:02:00,128 --> 00:02:22,258 But how a word is interpreted really depends on the context 24 00:02:22,258 --> 00:02:24,828 of what came before, and what follows after. 25 00:02:24,828 --> 00:02:29,411 So, the same word can mean multiple things. 26 00:02:29,411 --> 00:02:55,193 For example, if you claim that this word can only mean one thing, 27 00:02:55,193 --> 00:03:00,733 it can be called "form." But if it means multiple things 28 00:03:00,733 --> 00:03:05,198 depending on the context, we can call it "empty." 29 00:03:05,198 --> 00:03:07,481 That's what emptiness means. 30 00:03:07,481 --> 00:03:23,372 Emptiness in this context does not mean a complete absence 31 00:03:23,372 --> 00:03:25,857 of something or a complete void. 32 00:03:25,857 --> 00:03:30,812 It really means that everything is contextual and depends on the context 33 00:03:30,812 --> 00:03:37,430 in which the words are used or the definition the word falls under. 34 00:03:37,430 --> 00:03:52,876 Let's take an example: Somebody may look at you 35 00:03:52,876 --> 00:03:56,657 and claim that you are a good person. 36 00:03:56,657 --> 00:04:00,836 Another person may look at you and say you are a bad person. 37 00:04:00,836 --> 00:04:11,984 When somebody claims that you're a good person 38 00:04:11,984 --> 00:04:17,282 that means that Joe, you have an essence of goodness in you. 39 00:04:17,282 --> 00:04:24,332 And if somebody says you're a bad person 40 00:04:24,332 --> 00:04:30,897 then you have something within you that, that person is perceived as bad. 41 00:04:30,897 --> 00:04:48,699 So whether you have a bad factor or a good factor 42 00:04:48,699 --> 00:04:56,996 that's something that's intrinsic to you. Then that's the opposite of emptiness. 43 00:04:56,996 --> 00:05:16,656 But what emptiness refers to is that it's all about that person's perception 44 00:05:16,656 --> 00:05:22,126 as being good, or that person's perception as being bad. 45 00:05:22,126 --> 00:05:28,211 But there's nothing intrinsic within you that's good or bad. 46 00:05:28,211 --> 00:05:57,535 So in other words, you don't have an essential kind of form or an element 47 00:05:57,535 --> 00:06:01,050 or an attribute within you that somebody can point to 48 00:06:01,050 --> 00:06:03,465 and say that's good or that's bad. 49 00:06:03,465 --> 00:06:09,825 It is just their perception of you in that space and time context 50 00:06:09,825 --> 00:06:13,978 in which they claim that you are good or bad. 51 00:06:13,978 --> 00:06:27,786 So in that case when somebody says you are a bad person or you're a good person. 52 00:06:27,786 --> 00:06:31,597 Then I can say that she is neither good nor bad. 53 00:06:31,597 --> 00:06:35,600 She is just, she is empty. 54 00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:49,234 So that in that case empty doesn't means that you don't exist, 55 00:06:49,234 --> 00:06:52,954 that there's nothing, or there's just a void. 56 00:06:52,954 --> 00:06:58,924 It just means that there's no attribute within you, 57 00:06:58,924 --> 00:07:05,197 or an essence within you intrinsically that we can call as good or bad. 58 00:07:05,197 --> 00:07:09,837 Say we have this thing. 59 00:07:09,837 --> 00:07:27,323 Somebody actually ate a little bit of this thing and got healed. 60 00:07:27,323 --> 00:07:31,380 And so that person said 'Okay this is a great medicine’. 61 00:07:31,380 --> 00:07:40,805 But somebody else actually ate the same thing and then actually got sick. 62 00:07:40,805 --> 00:07:48,203 And that person pointed the same thing and said that's poison. 63 00:07:48,203 --> 00:07:57,522 So is this thing medicine or poison? 64 00:07:57,522 --> 00:08:00,862 There are three things. 65 00:08:00,862 --> 00:08:04,512 One is 'This is medicine', 66 00:08:04,512 --> 00:08:07,252 and one 'This is poison'. 67 00:08:07,252 --> 00:08:16,794 The third is that it has medicinal properties or it has poisonous properties. 68 00:08:16,794 --> 00:08:26,457 But this thing itself is empty. 69 00:08:26,457 --> 00:08:36,716 That means that it neither has toxic properties nor medicinal properties. 70 00:08:36,716 --> 00:08:43,807 That means that this is just the thing. 71 00:08:43,807 --> 00:08:55,912 But in whatever context and situation, this thing has been applied to 72 00:08:55,912 --> 00:09:03,230 sometimes has medicinal attributes or sometimes it has toxic attributes. 73 00:09:03,230 --> 00:09:17,313 So that's when you use the word empty or Gong (공) to refer to that 74 00:09:17,313 --> 00:09:24,708 this is neither medicinal nor toxic, you are neither good nor bad person. 75 00:09:24,708 --> 00:09:45,628 So all existence whether that's biological a thing or non biological organic 76 00:09:45,628 --> 00:09:49,553 or even a thought, a mental phenomena 77 00:09:49,553 --> 00:09:54,657 and it's just empty it's neither good nor bad. 78 00:09:54,657 --> 00:10:01,504 And it is just what it is. 79 00:10:01,504 --> 00:10:05,141 So that's why we call it or label it as empty 80 00:10:05,141 --> 00:10:08,465 because that's the truth it is what it is. 81 00:10:08,465 --> 00:10:40,895 However that thing how it's represented or manifest really depends on the situation 82 00:10:40,895 --> 00:10:45,165 the context and the connections in which it is allowed to manifest. 83 00:10:45,165 --> 00:10:50,390 So in some situations, you are a person in some situations, you're a bad person. 84 00:10:50,390 --> 00:11:02,968 In some situations this thing is a medicine in other it is a poison. 85 00:11:02,968 --> 00:11:14,681 So when we say Gong (공) the empty, 86 00:11:14,681 --> 00:11:19,268 that is kind of what a thing is what a phenomenon is. 87 00:11:19,268 --> 00:11:24,533 But however it's represented within the context or situation 88 00:11:24,533 --> 00:11:29,398 it finds itself in and that is what we call Form. 89 00:11:29,398 --> 00:11:40,483 Therefore if you really truly understand that all essence of all existence 90 00:11:40,483 --> 00:11:44,088 is really empty then there's no cause for you to suffer. 91 00:11:44,088 --> 00:11:52,258 Because you realize the person is neither bad nor good. 92 00:11:52,258 --> 00:12:05,514 That doesn't mean that person does not exist. 93 00:12:05,514 --> 00:12:10,804 That just means that the person in this situation in this space and time context 94 00:12:10,804 --> 00:12:21,077 under this specific set of conditions may appear to be good or bad to me. 95 00:12:21,077 --> 00:12:29,523 Doesn't look like you are fully clear on that. 96 00:12:29,523 --> 00:12:35,623 (Questioner) I am thinking of how you mention good or bad sometimes is empty. 97 00:12:35,623 --> 00:12:40,048 At the same time I can't help to think of historical dictators 98 00:12:40,048 --> 00:12:43,320 that have caused a lot of hurt. 99 00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:47,264 But also at the same time I have in my head explained to myself 100 00:12:47,264 --> 00:12:50,700 that they have violated the precepts. That's all. 101 00:12:59,478 --> 00:13:11,628 So even the precepts themselves are empty. 102 00:13:23,148 --> 00:13:29,760 I guess I am still a little confused about the precepts being empty. 103 00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:31,293 Do you mean they are dependent 104 00:13:31,293 --> 00:13:47,733 on the historical age we're in the society that we're in? 105 00:13:47,733 --> 00:14:06,132 (Sunim) There's no ethical precepts that we can absolutely say that this is the truth. 106 00:14:06,132 --> 00:14:10,662 That this is the way regardless of the situation and time and space 107 00:14:10,662 --> 00:14:17,432 that we find ourselves in, because that actually is a very dangerous path. 108 00:14:17,432 --> 00:14:53,212 So what Buddha taught us that the proper way the right way 109 00:14:53,212 --> 00:14:59,156 is always determined by the space and time of the situation that we are under. 110 00:14:59,156 --> 00:15:02,513 It's basically setting a compass down in a new place and seeing 111 00:15:02,513 --> 00:15:06,226 where it points north and that's when you find the right way. 112 00:15:06,226 --> 00:15:07,731 So everything is dependent 113 00:15:07,731 --> 00:15:12,186 even though the proper path on that, that's the middle way. 114 00:15:12,186 --> 00:15:17,956 And the concept of that middle way as it transition over to Mahayana Buddhism, 115 00:15:17,956 --> 00:15:22,363 it became translated or understood as emptiness. 116 00:15:22,363 --> 00:15:42,983 So the emptiness, the concept and the words, actually was a criticism 117 00:15:42,983 --> 00:15:46,883 against Theravada kind of rigid traditionalism 118 00:15:46,883 --> 00:15:54,633 in which they claimed that a certain set of ethical constructions was the way. 119 00:15:54,633 --> 00:16:05,492 And the criticism in Mahayana against that was that the construct should be empty. 120 00:16:05,492 --> 00:16:36,072 So basically the original criticism which Theravada's rigid absoluteness 121 00:16:36,072 --> 00:16:42,982 of the way was that there is no fixed way and that eventually got translated 122 00:16:42,982 --> 00:16:49,830 and kind of consolidated into the word emptiness. 123 00:16:49,830 --> 00:17:03,475 Basically when someone claims that this the truth, 124 00:17:03,475 --> 00:17:08,140 then the criticism is that there's nothing that you can point to and say 125 00:17:08,140 --> 00:17:19,934 that's the absolute truth, and that got translated into that sense of emptiness. 126 00:17:19,934 --> 00:17:35,114 So the fact that we misunderstand emptiness or the concept 127 00:17:35,114 --> 00:17:55,091 because of the word that we use in space, but it's only a part of all. 128 00:17:55,091 --> 00:18:10,547 We usually obsess over somebody else, if we like that person. 129 00:18:10,547 --> 00:18:19,176 And we want to make that person behave the way we want them to behave. 130 00:18:19,176 --> 00:18:25,595 So if they don't behave accordingly then we feel bitter. 131 00:18:25,595 --> 00:18:36,585 And if that disappointment becomes too much then we just let go, 132 00:18:36,585 --> 00:18:42,840 and we become indifferent to them. 133 00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:54,780 If we realize this concept of emptiness 134 00:18:54,780 --> 00:19:00,586 then we can actually let go of our obsession. 135 00:19:00,586 --> 00:19:08,155 Then we can allow him or her to behave as they want. 136 00:19:08,155 --> 00:19:12,155 If they ask for our help, then we help. 137 00:19:12,155 --> 00:19:17,405 If they don't ask for help, then we don't help. 138 00:19:17,405 --> 00:19:29,395 So we're neither indifferent in this case nor obsessive.