9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Hello. My name is Erin McCluskey. [br]This is a Wee BSL Blethers video on role models. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 You will see I have somebody with me. [br]Could you introduce yourself please? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 My name is Margaret McLean. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Marvellous! Do you have a sign name, Margaret? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Just MML. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I’ll call you this sign name today if [br]that’s alright? Okay. So I am going to 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 interview Margaret about her childhood. [br]Find out what it was like for her growing up, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 getting her first job and so on. [br]I’m really looking forward to finding out more. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Margaret, firstly, can I ask what it [br]was like for you growing up? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Well I come from a Deaf family so BSL [br]was used every day at home. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I only have a ran into issues outside [br]of home, with hearing people. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 It did make me a bit reluctant to mix. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 So growing up things were pretty easy [br]and comfortable in terms of accessible 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 communication, at home at least? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Easy, yes. Everybody signed every day [br]within my family so there were no issues at all. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 So your family were all Deaf then? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Parents? Your siblings? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes, all Deaf. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 And were you all close? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes, we were a close family I would [br]say, because of BSL. I was closest to 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 my father because he would tell me [br]a lot of stuff. I think he was my 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 role model growing up. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 How lovely. Your dad was your role model. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 He encouraged and supported you growing up? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Marvellous. And that’s a perfect link into [br]what I want to ask you about next 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 because I want to talk about school. [br]When you first went to school, what was it like? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I first went to a local school. One I could[br]walk to from home. I think it was only about 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 five minutes away. My parents wanted [br]me to go there so I was nearby. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 They did not want to send me away [br]to boarding school. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Unfortunately, the focus was very much [br]on speaking and listening so my parents 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 eventually decided to send me to a [br]school in Glasgow where they used sign language. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Makes sense. So your parents decided [br]to remove you from that local school 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 because it did not suit you and they [br]had to send you away. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Were you happy at your school in Glasgow? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 It was okay. They used sign language [br]there, but the teachers couldn’t really 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 sign very well. They would speak and [br]throw in a few signs here in there, but not many. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 And at that time I guess sign language was [br]very much seen as undesirable, am I right? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes. It was a long time ago now and there [br]were very old-fashioned views. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 There was no real awareness of the [br]language or its importance. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I think things are very different now of course. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 So, thinking about school, what was your [br]favourite topic and what did 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 you really hate learning about? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I really loved arithmetic. Nobody calls it [br]that anymore. It’s become maths hasn’t it. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 But we used to call it arithmetic. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Oh really! So you were good [br]at that and enjoyed it? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes. I loved arithmetic. I was okay at [br]English. The subject I really hated was sewing. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Really! Why? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes! I always used to mess it up and [br]get it wrong. I found it really frustrating. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Maybe you lacked [br]confidence in that subject. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I think you’re right. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 So you progressed through your schooling [br]and eventually left school. Did you have any 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 support to help you find a job. [br]Did you go to college or university? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 There was nothing really back then.[br]I do remember meeting with the 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Careers Advisor and telling them [br]I wanted to become a Teacher of the Deaf. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 They told me I could not do that because [br]I was Deaf myself. What a discriminatory attitude! 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I decided to ask the social worker [br]about it and told them the same thing, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 that I wanted to become a Teacher of [br]the Deaf. They also told me that I could 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 not do that job and suggested that [br]I become a machinist. I refused and they 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 said I would have to go [br]to the DHSS in that case. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 What is the DHSS? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 It’s what’s known as the DWP these days. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Oh I see. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Similar to the job centre now. So I went [br]along, and they suggested I try for office 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 work, which sounded okay, but it meant [br]I had to go to college. They helped me fill 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 in the application forms and I sent [br]them off. I soon heard that I’d been 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 offered a place which was great. [br]I went to college to learn how to be a secretary, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 but I found it really difficult [br]because I did not have an interpreter. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 How did you get on? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I managed the best I could. I kept asking [br]the lady sat next to me what we were 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 supposed to be doing. I think she [br]found it a bit frustrating. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 She was fed up that I was taking up [br]her time. I tried my best though and 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I did get through the course and [br]luckily, straight out to work. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 And you got your certificate? Did you [br]go off and work in an office then? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes that’s right. The course was a year [br]and then after that I got a job in an office. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I was there for seven years, [br]then I left to start a family. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 So when you became pregnant, you left [br]your job and focused on raising your family. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Did you take on any other work after that? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I did a few little jobs, but nothing [br]interesting until I saw an advert for a 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 BSL role model essentially. At that time, [br]the role was known as an auxiliary. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 It’s changed now. I was not successful [br]the first time I applied for one of these roles. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 It wasn’t until my third attempt [br]that I finally got a job. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Do you know why you were unsuccessful [br]the first two times you tried? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I don’t know. I think it was because the [br]organisation at that time was maybe not 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 aware of what BSL was and were not [br]expecting a Deaf person to apply for the role. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 The families they wanted someone to work [br]with were hearing, so perhaps they assumed 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 it would be better to have a hearing person[br]in post. I don’t know that for sure though. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 So you were finally successful on your [br]third attempt. What did your work as a 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 BSL advocate involved? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Well really, I just helped the parents. [br]I taught them sign language. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I supported nursery staff and primary [br]school staff and even secondary 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 school staff too, advising them how [br]to support their Deaf students. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 So you must have had to travel [br]around a lot for your job? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes, I travelled all over the place. [br]I had a lot of work to do. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 And did you teach sign language [br]as part of your role? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I did, yes. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Did you cover Deaf identity, [br]culture and so on as well? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes, I did, but my role was really more [br]focused around supporting the young person. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 For example, I would read a book with [br]them and explain the meaning of particular 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 words to try and increase their sign [br]vocabulary. I would do the same for numbers. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Sounds like a great job. Okay, let’s move[br]on a little to our connection. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 When I was little, you taught me[br]BSL didn’t you Margaret? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I did. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I remember Margaret working with me. [br]She was my role model. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 She gave me the most wonderful gift, [br]the gift of British Sign Language. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I feel incredibly lucky to have had the [br]opportunity to learn BSL from Margaret. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Without her, I don’t know what my life [br]would be like now. I don’t think I would 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 be where I am now. It didn’t just stop [br]with me though. I have been able to share 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 this beautiful language with my parents too. [br]This makes our family connections so much easier. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 So Margaret, you really are my role model. [br]When I was little, you used to come out 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 to my nursery. I still have some photos from [br]that time which I’d love to share with our viewers: 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 How sweet! Would you like to share any [br]memories of that time, Margaret? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I don’t really remember anything much [br]because I was so very young, but maybe you can. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Yes, I can remember very clearly. [br]I remember I started working with you 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 when you were about 1 ½. When I first [br]arrived, you ran off and hid under the table. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 You did this every single time I visited, [br]for weeks, and I visited twice a week. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Your mum would try to encourage you to [br]come out and finally you did, and we 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 started to form a bond. [br]After that, things got better. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I think I was probably just really thrown [br]because you were using sign language and 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 although my parents signed a little, [br]it was the first time I had met anybody 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 who was fluent in BSL. I just panicked. [br]Once I realised you were okay, things improved, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 and I learned so much from you.